Episode 145: Royale With Cheese (For Real This Time)

[00:00:00] Wording This program contains strong language, auditory violence and mental nudity. It is intended only for mature audiences, listener discretion is advised.

[00:00:13] Welcome to your Uncensored Home for World of Warcraft, News and Infants. This is Unshackled Fury.

[00:00:44] Spring has sprung as the booty battle continues. In reactions to World of Warcraft's newest edition, continue to roll in.

[00:01:11] Welcome back for episode 145 of your Uncensored Home for World of Warcraft, News and Opinions, Unshackled Fury.

[00:01:19] I'm your host Berzerker and once again is the King of Leaks, known as Mr. Jez Corden. Welcome back again, Good Sir.

[00:01:28] I'm hanging up the leaking hat, I guess it's me in too much trouble. But yeah, hey man, how's it going? It's been quite a news heavy couple of weeks in the World of Warcraft of Sphere.

[00:02:28] I'm a non-denomination or non-denomination. You're doing something today with family and food, chocolate and candy and bunnies and all bunch of things.

[00:02:59] But in Britain, there's a lot of chocolate being eaten and chocolate easter eggs. That's what Britain likes to do with Easter.

[00:03:06] But yeah, it's an also in World of Warcraft, noble garden I guess.

[00:03:11] Yeah, even in World of Warcraft there's a bit of British tradition there.

[00:03:16] Everywhere. Everywhere we look.

[00:03:20] And before we move on, because Jez, I've said it once, I've said it a thousand times. We cannot. I think we are constitutionally opposed to being able to do a single episode of this podcast without talking about Cyberpunk.

[00:03:37] Before we get to our metal album of the week, I think this is a good plug frankly for something that everybody should be watching was that you finally finished the Netflix series.

[00:03:50] And I'm so glad you finally finished it because it is so fucking gorgeous.

[00:04:02] It is so good. I was like, I didn't know what to expect because there is a stigma with video game adaptations whether it's like the Halo TV show and I wasn't being super popular with hardcore fans of the franchise.

[00:04:17] So I don't know if people say that the sequel, the second season rather has been a lot better.

[00:04:22] And then there's like, I recently checked out because Dragon's Dogma 2 has been big in the news. I've been playing Dragon's Dogma 2.

[00:04:28] You know, they made a Dragon's Dogma Netflix anime as well.

[00:04:32] Yeah, it's like a long time ago though and apparently I haven't watched it fully yet but lots of people say it's terrible.

[00:04:39] So there's a lot of stigma around these kind of adaptations but so-and-punk man's edge run has really raised the bar for this shit man.

[00:04:47] I'm like, I was so elated because you know, a big side punk fan in general, the genre but also, you know, the games and what's the project ready to do in and my pondsmith and all that kind of stuff.

[00:04:59] So I like for the TV adaptation to be so good and not going to be any spoilers here but you know, it's just perfect man.

[00:05:09] It was perfect. I kind of feel like the second half of it kind of rushed along a little bit.

[00:05:15] Like it almost feels like we want to tell this story but we've got to pack it into a certain amount of space and it does kind of feel like they've rushed.

[00:05:25] It's a little bit frantic the second half of this show but I think they're still executed really well.

[00:05:33] Great animation, great characters, great storyline, I felt empty by the end of it.

[00:05:40] Empty and just like wow, what a ride, what a rush. Maybe it's a good thing it's so frantic at the end because I did feel like I just finished a roller coaster man.

[00:05:49] So yeah, amazing. I highly recommend it.

[00:05:51] Yeah studio trigger.

[00:05:55] I think it's the one that had it and there just the one was first announced we're like all right so it's a couple years away

[00:06:01] and we knew we were going to have to wait for it but when it hit, I mean you know, I watched it right away and I think I've watched all the way through four times now.

[00:06:11] I actually was just watching the finale right before I jumped on the call with you because I was like oh yeah, this is so good.

[00:06:19] So good.

[00:06:21] It is the way that especially the last two episodes run it's just a hardcore sprint all the way to the end and then hold onto your emotions.

[00:06:33] That's all I got to say is because that shit.

[00:06:35] It really is like heavy.

[00:06:37] Yeah, it's really is like a blaze of glory isn't it?

[00:06:41] And I suppose like that's part of the theme of being an edge runner you live in life on the edge.

[00:06:45] You know and yeah, it's incredible man.

[00:06:48] Absolutely all the characters.

[00:06:50] It's hard to talk about without getting spoiler territory so we won't but definitely watch that show.

[00:06:55] It's absolutely incredible.

[00:06:56] They did a warcraft show on that level.

[00:06:58] It was so good.

[00:07:00] Man that's so that's that's kind of the last piece of this right is we always hear these little whispers about a warcraft show somewhere and it's things like edge runners.

[00:07:13] Exactly right I look at that man.

[00:07:16] Would you imagine if they went back and told I don't know the earth this story this way?

[00:07:22] Oh, call it the author story.

[00:07:24] That would be so good.

[00:07:26] Like with the style of like maybe the Castlevania anime and you know the darkness and the shadowy, you know, the the

[00:07:36] the strap home you know and that sort of gothic themes with the zombies and that could be so good if they did it.

[00:07:44] Microsoft's been quite aggressive in commission in these shows.

[00:07:48] They've got a Minecraft movie coming out with Jack Black.

[00:07:51] Yeah, they do and they've got the Halo TV show of the Paramount which you know some people have mixed on but they try and bless them.

[00:07:59] They've got a Gears of War movie in the works and also a Gears of War anime TV show in the works.

[00:08:05] A grounded TV show based on the survival game and a bunch of other stuff they work on us.

[00:08:11] Oh, this is definitely the Microsoft sort of interest to expand the footprint of their franchises and now they own world of warcraft maybe they'll green light some stuff there.

[00:08:20] Activision wonder done but we'll see what happens.

[00:08:23] I hope so because the kind of closes up, I know that there is going to be some sort of live action cyberpunk something and I keep watching all this stuff on full.

[00:08:33] I know we got the movie and I love the Warcraft movie but man there was so much left there for us.

[00:08:40] I would have loved a director's cut of that movie.

[00:08:43] Yeah, no shit.

[00:08:44] Just give me all the deleted scenes they talked about.

[00:08:47] Give me the full whack four hours.

[00:08:49] Yeah, give it to me.

[00:08:52] Mets and trying to sell me street meat.

[00:08:54] I want every cutscene of that.

[00:08:57] Yeah.

[00:08:58] All right well cyberpunk edge runners you haven't watched it.

[00:09:01] Check that shit out.

[00:09:03] And our metal album of the week.

[00:09:06] Now this one, Jess, I don't even know if you've heard of this band.

[00:09:09] I don't know if you've heard of anything about this band or this album.

[00:09:13] We're going to have to go all the way back to 1995 and we're going to talk about oh fucking weird one.

[00:09:18] This is a weird one and I was listening to this last week at work while I was doing some projects and I don't know why but we're going back to June 6th 1995

[00:09:30] to the album from the band primus.

[00:09:34] Hey, I love primus what are you talking about?

[00:09:39] Let's play for our love plan.

[00:09:41] That's like that's a classic album.

[00:09:44] Yes, it is.

[00:09:46] I'm going to listen to primus after it.

[00:09:48] I go into probably enough though I go into primus because of South Park.

[00:09:53] When I was a kid my first introduction to primus was South Park.

[00:09:58] And it came right in the middle of the end in credits.

[00:10:02] Intro music by primus I was like oh man, I check this band out.

[00:10:07] That's right.

[00:10:09] They've been around a long ass time.

[00:10:12] Less playful, right?

[00:10:13] The most famous central front man member there.

[00:10:17] This album in particular was known with a song by known as Big Brown Beaver.

[00:10:24] Yes.

[00:10:25] Which had a lot of content like in the 90s.

[00:10:29] This could have gone a lot of different ways and been related to different people and they've kind of danced around what it meant

[00:10:35] and what it was about.

[00:10:37] It took on a life of its own at that time.

[00:10:40] And the whole album itself is pretty odd.

[00:10:43] Like if you're not used to primus and you might be like oh primus, that's not metal.

[00:10:49] I mean it's funk metal, alternative metal.

[00:10:53] It's kind of right on the edge.

[00:10:56] It's male.

[00:10:58] It's spiritually metal.

[00:11:00] There you go.

[00:11:01] Spiritually metal.

[00:11:03] Yeah, like post metal.

[00:11:06] Post metal.

[00:11:09] It's funny you know when you're talking about album of the week I was thinking like well I've been listening to a metal album recently

[00:11:16] and the begger by swans and I was going to throw that in there and I was thinking wait is that actually metal?

[00:11:22] And I was thinking it's kind of spiritually metal.

[00:11:27] It's enough that it got you to buy the CD.

[00:11:30] Yeah, but I bought CD.

[00:11:32] Swans are one of the few bands that I always make sure I buy the CD.

[00:11:35] Even though I only listen to Spotify and don't own a single distro...

[00:11:39] Well, I suppose I could put it in my Xbox but who listens to the CDs through their Xbox?

[00:11:44] So that CD is being bought and it's staying in the cell phone going on shelf.

[00:11:48] Just literally just to support the band.

[00:11:50] I love swans so much.

[00:11:52] Yeah, promise is awesome too.

[00:11:53] I got a branch of promise CD as well.

[00:11:55] There you go.

[00:11:56] I still have a CD collection.

[00:11:58] I'm weird is that in the current year?

[00:12:00] I mean you're talking to somebody's half a generation older than you I think.

[00:12:05] So I've got puns of them somewhere in the garage but I also have a dual cassette tape deck in my stereo stack right here behind me.

[00:12:15] So you know, in the turntable and two cassette tapes there's not even a CD player up to it.

[00:12:21] So we got old school, new school around here.

[00:12:23] You know, we're just... we're appreciative of all the formats around the unshackled theory parts.

[00:12:29] That's even mini-disc.

[00:12:31] Even mini-disc.

[00:12:33] Somewhere even mini-disc has its laser disc.

[00:12:36] Who knows?

[00:12:37] Alright folks, well there's your metal album The Week.

[00:12:41] Primus Tales from the Punch Bowl.

[00:12:43] It is kind of a funny one.

[00:12:45] Just... I don't know.

[00:12:47] Just chill out and listen to it and don't you know...

[00:12:50] Don't go anywhere. Just sit and chill and listen. That's the vibe. Spiritual metal so...

[00:12:55] Give it a listen.

[00:12:57] And now,

[00:12:59] just we have a very relevant rage topic to us as content creators that we need to talk about.

[00:13:09] So let's get into it.

[00:13:12] Let's rage.

[00:13:20] You know, I'd like to think that you and I, Jess, that we are good stewards of the Warcraft content creator side of things.

[00:13:32] I think that, you know, we generally stay out of too much trouble.

[00:13:37] I think we support the brand.

[00:13:40] I think we support other creators.

[00:13:42] I think we are good stewards of the ship around here.

[00:13:47] And so, I have to say, I was very hurt when we found out that there was going to be a battle royale for the new plunderstorm game that we all know about.

[00:14:02] We'll talk about here in a little bit but...

[00:14:04] There was a content creator battle royale that was announced.

[00:14:08] And I did not get an invitation.

[00:14:13] You did not get an invitation.

[00:14:15] And I was bereft.

[00:14:18] I was beside myself.

[00:14:20] I was reclempt.

[00:14:22] I was completely befuddled, bemused.

[00:14:27] I didn't know what to do with myself.

[00:14:29] Do I stream? No.

[00:14:32] But...

[00:14:33] Do you have a PvP?

[00:14:35] I don't have a PvP.

[00:14:37] But they could have asked.

[00:14:40] What happened during the Tasons, Jess?

[00:14:43] I don't know.

[00:14:45] Not priority enough, I guess.

[00:14:48] Dang it.

[00:14:49] I guess if we throw in a few yards around, I don't know.

[00:14:53] That is the big news of Dejore.

[00:14:57] The big battle royale has dropped a few hints on it on the last show.

[00:15:02] When I mentioned Fortnite and stuff.

[00:15:05] But yeah, it was this...

[00:15:08] You know, the battle royale thing which is interesting.

[00:15:12] And it's definitely had an interesting reaction from the wider community wouldn't you?

[00:15:18] Yes.

[00:15:19] Plunderstorm is all the rage.

[00:15:22] So now that we got that quick thing out of the way.

[00:15:25] Now then that quick little lament of mine.

[00:15:28] Why don't we jump into the news and dive into Plunderstorm?

[00:15:39] Jess, do you wear glasses?

[00:15:41] I can't remember.

[00:15:42] I do wear glasses.

[00:15:43] These dang things, I tell you what.

[00:15:46] I'm about a year into this process.

[00:15:49] And I just...

[00:15:50] I cannot believe how dirty they get, how quickly all the time.

[00:15:53] Are you a new glasses wearer?

[00:15:55] Like only on the past year.

[00:15:57] Oh man, good, well, good, good for you.

[00:16:00] I made it a pass.

[00:16:02] That was the big get.

[00:16:04] I made it pass.

[00:16:06] I don't like if you make your past like 20 without glasses then you're scot free.

[00:16:11] I didn't know you could...

[00:16:13] Eventually you get caught.

[00:16:15] I did not know that.

[00:16:17] Yeah, my optimologist said if I made it to 40, I won't make it to 45.

[00:16:22] And she was right.

[00:16:23] Damn.

[00:16:24] That's a lot of luck.

[00:16:25] Yeah, I'm a condolences.

[00:16:27] Thank you.

[00:16:28] Thank you.

[00:16:29] You know, first world problems.

[00:16:30] So speaking of, Plunderstorm, all the rage and Jess, you knew...

[00:16:36] As you said before, we dropped some hints but you fully well knew for real.

[00:16:43] This is real.

[00:16:44] That this was going to be a 60 person battle royale like you, you were in the know.

[00:16:52] And so I'm actually kind of curious to get your take on this first is that...

[00:16:58] Did this meet with the expectation that you had just sort of like knowing it'll actually like,

[00:17:04] okay, I think I know what this is.

[00:17:06] And then seeing it and then getting your hands on it, like did this do anything for you?

[00:17:11] Did it match your expectation, exceed your expectation?

[00:17:13] What was your take on this thing?

[00:17:15] I kind of...

[00:17:16] I expected it to be along these lines.

[00:17:18] I mean, I had some information wrong.

[00:17:20] I think I'd throw it somewhere that it was 60 v 60 or something.

[00:17:24] And I was like, okay, well, I misread that bit.

[00:17:28] It wasn't 60 v 60.

[00:17:29] It was just...

[00:17:30] Well, I suppose it's 60 players versus each other.

[00:17:33] So kind of 59 versus one or something.

[00:17:37] I don't know.

[00:17:38] I misinterpreting that bit, which is whatever.

[00:17:41] But I knew it was going to be a separate client thing and you know,

[00:17:45] a separate mode not really sort of embedded in the game like it wouldn't be like a battleground in the game, you know?

[00:17:53] Necessarily or even, you know, canon, I suppose.

[00:17:59] But I was kind of impressed that the rewards carry over.

[00:18:02] I didn't think it would do that.

[00:18:05] I did know it was going to be a time limited thing.

[00:18:08] Like, it was sold to me as some kind of experiment, you know?

[00:18:12] So...

[00:18:14] I suppose...

[00:18:15] Six weeks.

[00:18:16] Six weeks, yeah.

[00:18:17] Well, it was largely in line with what I expected.

[00:18:19] I don't know if...

[00:18:25] I'm curious how well it's doing for Blizzard, I think.

[00:18:28] Because it is this weird experimental thing.

[00:18:31] But it must have had some decent devos go into it, you know?

[00:18:36] Because it's got...

[00:18:37] It's got its own rewards and all this kind of stuff.

[00:18:41] I don't know, they've got technology now where it's a little bit easier for them to ramp up these kind of separate modes fairly quickly, which is...

[00:18:52] That's where season of discovery came from, right?

[00:18:55] They can quickly and easily modify the game clients to build these kinds of modes out.

[00:19:01] And judging by GDC, which we'll talk about more in a bit,

[00:19:05] it does seem like these extra modes have served them in grown subscribers

[00:19:10] and maintaining subscriber base throughout the expansion,

[00:19:14] where typically the expansion would see a shrinking user base over the course of its life

[00:19:20] where people get bored and they want to wait for the next thing.

[00:19:23] But these like modes like season of discovery and I suppose Blunderstorm as well,

[00:19:27] kept people subscribed for longer.

[00:19:30] So it does seem to be working out for them but...

[00:19:33] I don't know if you feel the same way.

[00:19:35] I can't help but feel like the dev hours and the budget that went into Blunderstorm could have been used to make a proper season 4 for the retail.

[00:19:44] I can't help but feel that way.

[00:19:47] As someone who I don't care about PvP and I don't care about PvP that much in general,

[00:19:55] but I care about Bar Royal even less.

[00:19:58] So this is the definition of not for me, but that's kind of selfish because there are people who are enjoying it.

[00:20:06] There's people in my guild who enjoy it and they're playing it actively.

[00:20:10] Especially the younger people in my guild that enjoy it.

[00:20:15] My mind tanks in 19 or 20 or something.

[00:20:18] I've seen him talking about it quite a lot.

[00:20:21] So that's kind of the positive aspect to this.

[00:20:24] It appeals to potentially the generation that grew up in Bar Royal as their modus operandi of gaming in general.

[00:20:36] Maybe it's a good thing overall because one thing that well needs these new players, younger players,

[00:20:43] the next generation of players.

[00:20:46] So I can be taken two ways really.

[00:20:49] I'm so lucky that it's not for me, but at the same time I'm kind of glad that it exists.

[00:20:54] Yeah, I don't know that there's a whole lot of daylight between us on that.

[00:20:59] When I first got announced and looking at it, I was like, okay, this 60 person battle royale.

[00:21:04] I know what a battle royale is now, but I think I tried Fortnite once many years ago

[00:21:12] like now not doing this.

[00:21:15] But we found out, okay, six-week event.

[00:21:18] We got 40 renown levels.

[00:21:20] We can grind out there's a mountain, a transmog and another Pepe and they're selling official merch on the store

[00:21:27] and get making updates.

[00:21:28] There's even a million plunder secret achievement out there somewhere.

[00:21:33] They have put some work and interest into it.

[00:21:40] And like yourself is many times up about them.

[00:21:43] The show PVP is not my thing if you want PVP go listen to technically PVP our friends here.

[00:21:49] But I got to give it a shot right I got a podcast goddamn it.

[00:21:53] I got to get on there and see what the thing is so I get on there.

[00:21:56] I'm like all right, here we go and I'm getting dropped in and first I didn't even know

[00:22:03] that I could steer myself like coming into the map.

[00:22:06] I just, I just, I just fell.

[00:22:10] I mean I just you know fell wherever it was and I'm like okay and I start hacking on some things

[00:22:15] and I think I got I don't know 30 seconds in and I was like what's this ability to do?

[00:22:20] And then boom I'm dead.

[00:22:22] All right, all right, okay I see you.

[00:22:25] Luckily you know you could have checked out you don't have to watch the whole thing

[00:22:28] you could leave and then jump into another game.

[00:22:30] So I did that and then I think I lasted maybe another couple minutes and then boom I get killed

[00:22:34] and I'm out again.

[00:22:35] That's the battle experience.

[00:22:38] Yeah, I tried again.

[00:22:39] I'm like all right let's go and then I was like I'm just going to stick around the edge.

[00:22:42] I'm going to avoid everybody.

[00:22:44] I'm just going to try to get these moms by myself and kind of try to level up and get some things.

[00:22:49] And I ended up in a battle with one guy finally who caught me and when he killed me he did the cry emote

[00:22:56] and I was like you know what?

[00:22:57] I've had enough.

[00:22:58] I'm done.

[00:22:59] I think I've had enough.

[00:23:01] And so I didn't know.

[00:23:02] I jumped out.

[00:23:03] I was like yeah this is this not not for me.

[00:23:07] I appreciate the gimmick and like the piracy nature of it and your chasing stuff around

[00:23:15] and you got kind of just random abilities and double jump and it's very different but within

[00:23:21] the same sort of universe and so it was kind of this alternate universe lens that was kind

[00:23:26] of neat to see.

[00:23:27] But then I got in with the homie Rommel into some duos and that actually did make a difference.

[00:23:40] Duos is the way to go.

[00:23:41] Doing it by yourself I think is terrible.

[00:23:44] I will never go into another one by myself.

[00:23:48] I just saw the people and all of you listening that already you know went out and grinded these

[00:23:53] 40 renowned levels.

[00:23:54] I will never see the end of that.

[00:23:55] I probably I think I'm at four right now for now for I'm thinking very close to five.

[00:24:00] I may never see five.

[00:24:01] I don't know.

[00:24:02] I just saw that they announced trios are coming so hey why not two good three is better.

[00:24:09] That did make a difference to me but overall there's very little chance that I will come

[00:24:18] back to this actively unless there's some major major reward or some other tie that

[00:24:24] like I have to have.

[00:24:28] You know it was funny before we got in before I got in seeing the other content creators and sort of

[00:24:37] their reactions and some people just shitting all over it some people absolutely loving it then

[00:24:42] people getting mad at the people that were shitting on it and then there was the people that were

[00:24:47] saying oh I love it and then privately saying that they hate it.

[00:24:52] That was a thing.

[00:24:53] Oh yeah you can't trust a content creator Jess.

[00:24:58] I mean I say that knowing for well what you and I are doing here but I mean it was brought to my

[00:25:05] attention of at least one who publicly was like oh you know this is this is great or

[00:25:10] whatever and then privately slamming it and I'm like you know God I mean it happens all the time.

[00:25:17] Just sort of the disingenuousness of certain content creators just cracks me up but overall this does very much

[00:25:24] feel like the target audience is different than us which traditionally warcraft has an older

[00:25:31] audience face audiences if I understand sort of the metrics correctly so it's targeting

[00:25:38] towards somebody else younger I think like you said more interested in that battle royale blizzard

[00:25:45] as it is want to do bringing a battle royale out many years after it seems to be in its height of

[00:25:50] relevance maybe I'm wrong about that but the one thing that I did enjoy about it was way back

[00:25:57] when in the in the burning crusade era we had basically welfare epics where if you would

[00:26:06] call them is if you win in and did PVP all you didn't have to win if you just did like a three on three

[00:26:13] and you did like ten of them or something you got can remember exactly how it worked but you could

[00:26:18] get yourself a piece an epic piece of gear and at that time there were some PVP pieces that were

[00:26:25] better than PVE pieces to the point where I got some pants off a gruel due to a loot

[00:26:32] council in the guild that I was in and it was so uproarious that I was gifted such a thing

[00:26:37] when I had the PVP pants that were supposed to be better than the guild broke up what

[00:26:42] what they're getting it yes let's get a lot for a draw man yeah pretender a rest in peace

[00:26:52] the the feeling of going in and just grinding these things out with a friend it did kind

[00:26:58] of elicit that feeling again which was kind of fun and so I did enjoy that aspect of it

[00:27:04] like all right we're just bang on these things out because we kind of like have to win away so

[00:27:08] it was just a good chance for me my buddy to catch up and we played and that was kind of it but

[00:27:14] yeah man I don't this is clearly enough for us and that is also I think indicative or

[00:27:21] I think I think I think what also sort of indicates that this is the thinking is if you look at

[00:27:28] the people who were actually invited to the creator content creator battle royale it was not a bunch

[00:27:34] of known wild streamers it was kind of across the board of people who streamed and

[00:27:41] people complained about that and then you had people that were like well this is a marketing

[00:27:49] gimmick so don't take it personally because they invited these huge streamers because as

[00:27:57] you pointed out just they're trying to get eyeballs on work craft they're trying to get eyeballs

[00:28:01] on the product and so they're casting a wide net and if it costs them $50,000 in prize money

[00:28:06] and the cost to do the production that's probably money well spent

[00:28:11] and that's how they're gonna choose to look at these things so yeah I know talking cheek around here

[00:28:19] don't really have a problem with who they invited to the battle royale I could not give a shit

[00:28:23] I would have it would have been a complete waste of time for me and everybody else

[00:28:27] but were you surprised at all by how they handled the battle royale which by the way I did watch

[00:28:32] and I thought it was very fun and I thought they did a great job and apparently a French duo

[00:28:37] that were not deaf punk won it and yeah I thought it was well done but did you get a chance to look at it

[00:28:44] did you already thoughts about the battle royale I didn't play it myself

[00:28:49] I've been really busy work the past couple of weeks with dragons dogma too so I kind of

[00:28:55] been out of pocket a little bit on that stuff but you know I keep an eye on the discussions about it

[00:29:02] they just come up in my reddit feed and stuff like that

[00:29:06] you know it's interesting to see the the back and forth on it and is it a good thing

[00:29:10] is a bad thing you know I do think like in the spirit of wow wanting to sort of find what its next generation players looks like

[00:29:21] it's probably a good experiment to have done and they did Holly Longdale did tease that the next experiment will be B-P-V-E oriented

[00:29:30] which you know that sounds interesting I'll read that statement a little bit

[00:29:34] yeah yeah you know I got people thinking about things like the mage tower or you know

[00:29:39] maybe a better version of tourgast because I really liked the idea of tourgast but the execution just wasn't that great

[00:29:46] so maybe they can look at some of that stuff and hopefully maybe like something that adds

[00:29:54] maybe a little spice to season four because I know we're going to talk about that in a bit

[00:29:58] but I'm not really season four seems a bit anemic at the moment

[00:30:04] so yeah I suppose that's my thought on it my thought process is like

[00:30:09] it's cool that I've done it and it's cool that they are looking to ways to appeal to maybe a younger audience

[00:30:17] but I got back to what I've said here before on the show that if you want to appeal to younger audiences

[00:30:22] you've got to do somewhat about the starting experience again because time walking in it man

[00:30:27] I just not you know going back to a previous timeline where you don't know what the hell is going on

[00:30:33] stories all messed up and you finish you finished the expansion before you actually hit the level cap

[00:30:39] no the other way around you hit the level cap before you finish the expansion

[00:30:42] so you don't get the story properly they need to completely revamp their sort of experience

[00:30:48] of being like level one to 60 and I've always thought that that includes another

[00:30:53] carcassum style revamp of the old world because that's where you really get that's

[00:30:58] where you really get in tune with your character and immersed in the role playing aspect of

[00:31:04] being a hoarder or a lion's and all that kind of stuff and it's been heavily neglected over the years

[00:31:10] and I don't think Battle Royale is going to move the needle frankly

[00:31:13] I think you need all the other stuff on top of it just depends but that is for sure a much bigger job

[00:31:21] than just building a quick little battle royale mode so yeah I don't know we'll see

[00:31:27] yeah you're right and we'll touch on season 4 it does seem to be a bit of an event

[00:31:32] and people seem to be a little low key myth about it so maybe more high key but yeah

[00:31:42] yeah so we'll see a plunderstorm will be around for a little bit

[00:31:47] it's only been out for a couple weeks at this point should have another I think month to go

[00:31:52] so it's going to be around they're going to keep making changes to it like I said

[00:31:56] they're about to add trios so that should change things up make it a little more fun

[00:32:01] and who knows I appreciate the effort that they are trying to put it into finding something

[00:32:07] different but as you said you know as a pve player

[00:32:13] I would love to see the figures and the stats of you know the participation of who does what

[00:32:19] and sort of as I was arguing the pve should be priority and for the most part it very much is

[00:32:26] so I don't want to take away from the pve piece less of the cake because they really get it

[00:32:33] hopefully hopefully we'll see something a little more pve oriented along these wacky lines

[00:32:40] I think that's worth it so

[00:32:44] so understorm doubt another month you like it

[00:32:47] congratulations if you don't we'll see you in that room

[00:32:52] now the next one the next item I have here

[00:32:57] you are again uniquely qualified I think to talk about which is John height

[00:33:04] who is the sea is the mouthful the senior vice president and warcraft franchise general manager

[00:33:11] say that ten times fast he was recently at GDC for shorts but GDC what is GDC

[00:33:21] the games developer conference and what the hell is that it's a conference for game developers

[00:33:29] no it's like it's an annual it's literally it's an annual conference for game developers

[00:33:36] and they have sort of like panels and sometimes they know it's games that these things

[00:33:41] and they do a little marketing beets especially indie staff

[00:33:44] it's a good way a good place for you know devs to market you know market their games

[00:33:49] and network and you know pitch their games to publishers and be like hey we want to make this game

[00:33:54] here's the prototype give us five hundred million dollars you know kind of thing

[00:33:59] and then the publishers say no you can't have five hundred million dollars

[00:34:02] and it's going and then there's all this back and forth you know

[00:34:05] but yeah that's pretty much that's pretty much what is for

[00:34:08] okay it's all business all game development all the time

[00:34:11] and okay yeah they are blizzard was there with world warcraft

[00:34:15] and some rare frankness about shadowlands and the negative impact it had

[00:34:25] but also that something positive share which was that the subscriber figures as I mentioned earlier

[00:34:31] have been uniquely resilient this expansion because of all the modes

[00:34:36] and the season to discovery and the hardcore stuff

[00:34:39] and you know basically everything that isn't retail

[00:34:43] but also I would argue that retail is probably done better than usual as well

[00:34:49] because you can see that from the mythic plus trackers and stuff that are out there

[00:34:55] they showed that you know there was more mythic plus runs done over the course of the season

[00:35:02] then they'd seen from previous expansions and previous seasons and stuff

[00:35:07] so even if like plunderstorm and seen discovery and classic hardcore

[00:35:12] if all those modes had a positive impact on overall subscribers

[00:35:15] it does seem to have had a high low effect on the amount of people running stuff in retail too

[00:35:21] so generally all positive all around and yeah

[00:35:26] so it's boats it boats well for the war within

[00:35:30] if it is of a high quality and the extra modes are well baked

[00:35:34] and as you know successful alpha period then we should have a lot of

[00:35:38] you know good stuff on the horizon I suppose

[00:35:43] yeah and for those of you that haven't seen what we're talking about yet

[00:35:49] there was a Korean web-zine inven who first posted some

[00:35:54] I believe screenshots or pictures of slides

[00:35:58] that John height was showing during his presentation at GDC

[00:36:03] and a couple things as Jez mentioned that he touched on one

[00:36:07] were subscriber numbers although in this presentation no numbers

[00:36:14] no actual numbers were provided I'll get to that more in a second

[00:36:17] but essentially what it showed was just the graph of unlabeled subscriber numbers

[00:36:23] from the time of Legion basically up until season of discovery

[00:36:30] just recently here in world of work graph

[00:36:33] so after the launch of dragonflight

[00:36:35] and so part of what they were talking about was the sort of reliable

[00:36:40] as it says here we expected to continue that reliable subcurve

[00:36:44] through Shadowlands and dragonflight and then they show

[00:36:47] what was historically higher churn and they kind of plotted out a couple of points

[00:36:51] on the graph that were lower than they expected

[00:36:54] and before I get to the actual numbers the other slide of interest was

[00:36:59] things that went wrong shadowlands

[00:37:02] Shadowlands just a big logo

[00:37:04] yeah that's all they should have done we just put the jaylor's you know decrepit face

[00:37:09] with the shadowlands logo just right there's things that went wrong

[00:37:12] and then just moved on but in the slide they do have a couple of categories here

[00:37:16] one a story in setting and the bullet points underneath that after life

[00:37:19] setting wasn't accessible new antagonist wasn't developed oh my god

[00:37:23] that should have been on there three times and well known story heroes were diminished

[00:37:28] hmm under under gameplay its systems didn't evolve with player expectations borrowed power

[00:37:34] which people were tired of and not enough variety

[00:37:38] there you go lots of complaints about those systems and then under community gaps

[00:37:42] in content which yeah huge low lack of transparency decision making right

[00:37:47] and then didn't feel heard right this is the thing we talk about so often is all the player feedback

[00:37:53] that seems to go into a black hole but they have they have been better you know nothing's perfect

[00:37:58] but they have been better so trying to own up to yeah the shadowlands arrow was was was pretty shitty

[00:38:04] uh but here they say we've established the relationship with their players

[00:38:08] and they showed the numbers climbing with dragonflies and season to discovery well

[00:38:12] credit to Belialar who you know I met that little fella when we were at Bliscon

[00:38:19] and he was he was sweaty and on his way to do something but he was very nice

[00:38:24] and I do give him grief sometimes because I think that some of his videos are just

[00:38:30] I don't know he's a youtuber and so you gotta do things I guess to keep the YouTube's

[00:38:35] hey but he actually took some data some legitimate data and tried to plot out

[00:38:42] what are subscriber numbers actually look like now because if you remember way back in the hey day

[00:38:47] we had 12 million subscribers during the wrath of the lich king you damn right they told us

[00:38:52] they're like yeah you know and then it started to drop down to like 10 and 9 and 8

[00:38:57] and they're like I don't know if we want to talk about this anymore and so they stopped giving us those numbers

[00:39:02] a decade ago and so we just kind of guess now we're just like I don't know what it is

[00:39:10] so credit to Belialar he kind of plotted this out and essentially what we're looking at is

[00:39:17] if I if I understood this correctly sort of like an average subscriber base is about 5.8 million

[00:39:26] and we had a height of 8.27 million when was the season of discovery launched the classic

[00:39:36] let me pull this up here yeah when world of Warcraft classic launched we went up to 8.27 million

[00:39:43] is what they had plotted out from a low of 4.07 million towards the end of battle for Azeroth

[00:39:51] so battle for Azeroth or mid battle for Azeroth you know was not doing well shadow lands almost as high as that

[00:39:59] piece will went down after classic came back and shadow lands shadow lands also seem to have a peak of about 8.7 million

[00:40:05] plummeted down to 4.5 and then it looks like it kind of came up around 6 ish for dragon flight and now it's up again to 7.25 million

[00:40:15] was season of discovery so all in all I think we've been wondering about this number for years I have thrown out what my guesses are

[00:40:25] I was assumed we were kind of in the 5.7 million range at the height somewhere in there so I think we always kind of felt like that was the range ish

[00:40:35] but for you jazz the professional one here do these numbers track for you does this does this look right does this make sense is there anything about this

[00:40:45] presentation that seems surprising to you well the thing about graphs and charts is that like one graph could use a completely

[00:40:52] different scale to another graph so it's like you can't you can't really line them up and take them at face value

[00:40:57] but I was still interested in it because people were asking me about it and the the graph was being circulated around you know fair or not you know as evidence

[00:41:07] and whatever and you know I've got a pretty good inside track of this at these days and I just asked my contact I said do these numbers look

[00:41:14] anywhere near accurate to you and long story short my source or one of my sources I should say out of several

[00:41:24] I said yeah that's yeah humble brag that's roughly on the money you know all right without giving any exact figures of course so

[00:41:34] yeah the numbers are always sensitive you know and I suppose like it's doubly sensitive now with you know Microsoft

[00:41:44] Microsoft God's numbers yeah Microsoft God's their numbers very very aggressively they don't talk about game pass subscribers anymore for example

[00:41:52] I don't talk about Xbox console sales either for some reason no they don't for similar reasons they're losing so like it's like we don't talk about numbers of this company

[00:42:06] so I don't have the exact numbers but they say yes it's roughly on the money but I thought like even though people were going back and forth about whether or not the numbers was specifically accurate

[00:42:16] I don't think that's the real story and it's really funny someone linked me a clip of Asmond Gold saying because someone as my gold was putting down on these numbers

[00:42:24] and you know I think it's fair to do so because we don't know what the scale is and the scale doesn't have any any numbers on it

[00:42:33] and it could be a completely different scale to the other graph and you know most likely is a different scale but

[00:42:39] and and someone in chat was like oh but just said they're accurate and and then ask one God said something like I don't care about what Twitter random say

[00:42:49] she's funny so oh my god that's fantastic yeah it's funny because Asmond Gold's reported on my stuff before you know

[00:42:58] but I you know I I realized that I have a much much smaller platform but anyways it's it's all fun and games

[00:43:07] but like I said I don't have the exact numbers and yeah I don't know if we'll ever get the exact numbers unless you know someone like Jason Shroyer from Bloomberg

[00:43:17] you know a professional journalist actually gets them yeah

[00:43:22] but the real stories like I was saying it the real stories of the upwards trajectory like the comparison against Shadowlands

[00:43:29] I think he's really compelling the fact that Shadowlands they were so frank and admitting that Shadowlands had completely bombed out the whole game

[00:43:36] and you know everyone hated every aspect of it and they really wasted Shadowlands man

[00:43:42] I remember like in Ratholich King where there's a quest there's a crack there's a quest in Ratholich King where like

[00:43:48] they talk about the Shadowlands and they're like well there's a bunch of quests actually about the Shadowlands

[00:43:54] because you you're deathmites get their charger from the Shadowlands in the starting area

[00:43:58] and then there's like another quest in Dragon Blight where I can't remember his name

[00:44:03] you're helping one of the one of the death night characters do something like exercise spirits or something

[00:44:10] and then you teleport into the sort of Shadowlands area of Dragon Blight you know Paranel

[00:44:17] you know you slip through beyond the veil into the veil of death

[00:44:20] and it's kind of like it's kind of cool it's like it's like it's mysterious

[00:44:25] and it kind of felt like there's something really interesting compelling about the idea of a Shadow-y Mirror world

[00:44:34] that there was sort of billion back in Ratholich King and then obviously like the actual Shadowlands

[00:44:40] is some weird metaphysical disconnected bunch of matrix worlds basically

[00:44:49] where some dude designs arbitrary afterlives and then just sends you completely randomly to them

[00:44:58] it makes no sense, it makes no logical sense and one of it does

[00:45:01] oh man listen I'll talk about it too much or I'll just get really mad

[00:45:04] but like I say I was raining back in

[00:45:07] yeah I was so desperate for resolution and from all that stuff

[00:45:11] that I actually bought all the books to do Shadowlands I was like this has got to make sense in one of the books

[00:45:16] somewhere I'm reading these books and it's just like no not of it makes any sense

[00:45:20] even with all these extra books so you know I mean to be fair it's the only time I've ever tried buying books for wow

[00:45:26] I was that desperate to get my sense of what they were trying to get

[00:45:29] wow so maybe that's the way to sell boxes to make the storyline really confusing

[00:45:35] but I've got my copy of the Grim War of the Shadowlands right back here

[00:45:39] exactly you know all that stuff and also the Sylvanas book

[00:45:43] but anyway it's good that they've identified all that kind of stuff

[00:45:47] and it's good that you know they're sort of they're shouting out about their upwards momentum

[00:45:56] I'm being like yeah we're in a good place for the war within

[00:46:00] and you know war within has Chris Metzen on it

[00:46:04] which you know Chris Metzen is one of the founding fathers of World of Warcraft

[00:46:10] so there's this kind of like there's obviously big hope there that

[00:46:15] we're gonna go back to an era where we've got a coherent story compelling characters

[00:46:20] maybe something with a little bit of edge and a little bit of you know darkness

[00:46:25] that's actually coherent I guess because like I actually kind of liked where they were going

[00:46:31] I put this on record and I know I know it upset you as an alliance player

[00:46:35] but I kind of liked when Sylvanas put on down the tree

[00:46:38] I was kind of like I understand I understand

[00:46:40] I understand I was kind of like this is huge this is like this is really compelling

[00:46:45] this has to have some kind of this is gonna go somewhere really cool

[00:46:48] and they just kind of they didn't stick the landing

[00:46:51] like Sylvanas should not still be alive

[00:46:55] but they didn't want to they didn't have the conviction to really follow through on a true war story

[00:47:02] and it ends up coming off like a Saturday morning cartoon

[00:47:05] so hopefully Chris Metzen can remind everyone that the play by our adults

[00:47:12] and yeah it's so it's exciting to see

[00:47:15] no it's funny that you mentioned Chris Metzen just this morning

[00:47:18] and I can't remember exactly how we got on to it but I started showing my son

[00:47:22] the Azeroth choppers series

[00:47:25] and you remember when they had the it was a comp it this was ten years ago

[00:47:32] it was it was two thousand fourteen it was like right around now April

[00:47:36] it was a competition between a Horde team and an alliance team and they built those motorcycles

[00:47:43] oh yeah yeah yeah the chopper yeah yeah yeah

[00:47:45] the chopper right

[00:47:46] and so team alliance was headed by Chris Metzen

[00:47:50] it was Chris Metzen Terran Gregory and Monty Crow

[00:47:53] and well it's it's so funny now that you know I've gotten to know Terran a little bit

[00:47:58] and you know Chris Metzen's my you know personal Lord and Savior

[00:48:02] and Monty seemed nice he's since recently left and the Horde team was headed by Samwise Didier

[00:48:07] which you know it doesn't get much better than that but it was so

[00:48:13] it was like a laser point back to a time when in my brain like what is warcraft

[00:48:20] what are the ideals what are the what are the sort of like aesthetics

[00:48:23] and the and the words that are spoken around it I don't know what it is but like hearing them both describe

[00:48:29] you know Chris Metzen's describing like what makes the alliance

[00:48:34] and Sam Didier is describing you know what makes the Horde

[00:48:38] and it's just like hearing those two talk about this

[00:48:41] it was it was like it was like coming home it was comforting I don't know it was it was weird

[00:48:47] you know yeah I'm alliance through and through I still hate that bike

[00:48:51] I will never like it I think it looks ridiculous

[00:48:56] there were a million other things they could have done but that thing looks atrocious

[00:49:00] or the Horde bike I don't know about the track but it is a badass looking bike

[00:49:05] so you know got tank trends what do you want

[00:49:09] but anyway yeah it it was nice seeing that and certainly to kind of wrap this back up is looking at the slide

[00:49:16] they showed a GDC where it's like we've reestablished the relationship with our players and showing like

[00:49:21] all of the things that are coming out you know guardians of the dream and season of discovery and now

[00:49:27] and then looking ahead they got classic cataclysm and war within and more

[00:49:33] and they show this like kind of naturally wanting to arc up there's no line that matches them

[00:49:38] as they go further up the slide but clearly they are intending to climb to those heights

[00:49:43] although when I looked at this and I was like oh eight million five million I'm kind of looking at the graph

[00:49:47] and I'm like you know twelve million would have looked like frickin Mount Everest

[00:49:52] you know the height of wrath next to this and you know but that's kind of what we've come accustomed to is it feels like

[00:49:59] that wave happens like when South Park happen make love not warcraft

[00:50:05] and that that cultural zeitgeist moment like that that has passed

[00:50:09] I don't know that warcraft will ever have that again I'm okay with that I'm fine with that

[00:50:14] it's the stability right are we stable and it looks like from this yes there's definitely some lows

[00:50:20] but they are actually kind of stable so it's stable it's profitable you know

[00:50:28] the thing about capitalism and I don't want to ever you don't want to get into a big philosophical discussion about it

[00:50:36] but it's a big issue in the wide of Microsoft Xbox gaming

[00:50:41] organization at the minute like Microsoft keeps going doing these interviews where it's like where do we find the growth

[00:50:47] where do we find the growth it's not enough to stay still because you costs always go up

[00:50:52] costs always go up wages go up electricity server costs all that stuff always goes up

[00:50:58] and you know warcrafts no exception so like it's not enough to be stable in capitalism

[00:51:06] you have to not just be stable but you have to be growing and looking to expand the growth sideways and stuff

[00:51:12] which is why like they do do things like warcraft rumble and they do hearthstone

[00:51:16] they do do do a lot more much to the chagrin of everyone you know do you guys have phones

[00:51:21] and all that kind of stuff and you know it's joking about warcraft world warcraft mobile in the in the in the

[00:51:27] in the

[00:51:29] but you know it's the funnily enough it's the kind of thing they're thinking about when they're talking about expanding to an audience

[00:51:35] is you know how do we find the growth to sustain what we love to do you know which in and we all love warcraft as it is

[00:51:43] but they have to do this other stuff because costs are going up so it's not enough to stay still

[00:51:48] and I know a lot of people don't hear that you know there's plenty of criticisms you could factor in there too

[00:51:55] like maybe the exec should be paid less I'm not saying no to that

[00:52:02] I always support that yeah and the high end people should be taxed more so you know

[00:52:10] and they should do more to manage costs going up and up and up and all that kind of stuff

[00:52:15] but that's a complete separate discussion the problem is we live in the world that we live in right now

[00:52:20] and that's that's a world where costs are going up and they have to kind of manage that you know

[00:52:25] so these were these and it's good to know that it's healthy and growing you know against those costs

[00:52:34] well and it's as a resident of California I mean I love living here I will probably never live anywhere else by choice

[00:52:41] but I'll be the first to tell you it is expensive housing is expensive cost of living just in general is expensive

[00:52:48] and so if you're headquartered here you're paying high salaries you are as you said paying high prices for energy

[00:52:55] because let me tell you ever since we started getting worse wildfires and all the other stuff that's happened over the last decade

[00:53:02] our power prices have just exploded because these companies are having to pay out all these fines

[00:53:09] and they're passing the book on us people didn't do anything wrong you know

[00:53:13] so it is very expensive and you have to have these sort of side hustles and it's sort of like thunderstorm

[00:53:20] it may not be for me it doesn't have to be for me right if it brings in more people to help kind of steady that load

[00:53:27] that is a good thing and I guess the last thought that I have is as I look at the subscriber numbers

[00:53:32] at least bled it to world of warcraft they'd be very interested to see what the actual income line is

[00:53:40] matching against this taking into account not just subs but also micro transactions

[00:53:45] yeah that's true I mean what's another way to grow yeah

[00:53:49] that's another way we've been able to grow is you know slipping in micro transactions mounts and services on the side

[00:53:57] you know the the subscription fee hasn't really grown in line with inflation they've kept that relatively low

[00:54:05] I know they put the price up a couple of times but it is relatively low against inflation if you actually go back and look

[00:54:12] but they've found growth in other ways which is you know micro transactions return I will remain to be a controversial subject

[00:54:18] and I think there's definitely you know criticism you could make of micro transactions like especially in Diablo

[00:54:25] I kind of feel like with the case of Diablo it's like all the best looking armor in the game comes out of the micro transactions store

[00:54:32] makes me not want to bother playing the game because it's like well I get junk from playing the game

[00:54:38] and then I just buy a skin from the micro transactions shop and then I end up using that forever

[00:54:43] instead of actually one of those

[00:54:45] the skins in Diablo can range from anywhere from like ten bucks to you know

[00:54:50] 15 20 bucks for like one of those packs but then they've been criticized for these like bundles

[00:54:56] where it goes anywhere up to like $70 for like amount some skins and like a bunch of all the stuff

[00:55:03] they were criticized for four color swaps for the Diablo version of a hearthstone

[00:55:10] the temple four color swaps for 40 dollars the town ports

[00:55:15] wow yeah and they were class restricted too so they were heavily criticized for that one

[00:55:21] but you know this is the thing when you sort of when you folk when you get a little bit to growth has to happen

[00:55:28] you know I don't think I think it's just something we have to accept as a symptom of capitalism or whatever

[00:55:34] growth has to happen but I think like there has to be like when you become too obsessed with it

[00:55:42] and you focus becomes too heavy on the money and the numbers

[00:55:47] that's when the games suffer and that's when like you focus on money and growth and numbers in a sort of

[00:55:53] robotic spread sheety kind of way that's when it can have the opposite intended impact of what you try and do

[00:56:00] and I think that's what borrow power was and borrow power was like game designed by the numbers where they're like

[00:56:06] okay well we don't people to we don't people yeah we want people to feel like they get

[00:56:12] they're getting like a new feature with those expansions right and but we can't have power going up forever

[00:56:21] so we're gonna make it so those features are rented and they disappear at the end of the expansion

[00:56:26] and you know Destiny is going through these two where they pretty much they put all their previous expansions in the vault

[00:56:33] to make you want to play the new content or to drive you to the new content

[00:56:38] but on the flip side of that people start feeling like well it's not worth my time you know

[00:56:44] and when they've got a game design system like borrowed power where you just you know that it's going away at the end of the expansion

[00:56:51] it feels less compelling than something that you know is gonna stick around like dragon riding

[00:56:55] so hopefully they've learned that lesson and we'll be happy for it

[00:57:02] and we will certainly see it is nice at the end of the day to see this level of public introspection

[00:57:12] from Blizzard because we really just have not gotten a lot of that in recent years

[00:57:18] and it seems to be part of the overall mentality that they've been showing under Holly Longdale and John Hyte

[00:57:27] is trying to be more transparent about what we're doing, why we do it, where we're at and you know yeah

[00:57:34] there's always gonna be things that we don't know we're not entitled to any of this information

[00:57:38] so seeing it in this way it really in many ways as a gift and I do appreciate they're continuing to keep true to their word

[00:57:47] as much as they can and things of this nature so if you haven't seen it there's a few articles out there

[00:57:53] and I think that's probably the most comprehensive one is reflecting on 30 years of warcraft

[00:57:58] Blizzard reveals subscriber trends at GDC and also the Belular video reports

[00:58:04] wow it's actual subscriber count and something else I can't read the rest of the title but you go to Belular stage

[00:58:11] I'm sure we'll see it so check it out for yourself, we're seeing and yeah hopefully wow continues to be in good health

[00:58:21] season 4, mentioned season 4 now a couple times

[00:58:25] yep this will be essentially as far as we understand it the swan song for Dragon Flight

[00:58:34] we've now had the sort of the three main tranches of content for Dragon Flight where we had the big raids and the new areas

[00:58:46] and all that kind of stuff and so back in Shadowlands we started this sort of experiment with this season 4

[00:58:53] this kind of random grab bag and we're just gonna put shit in the bag shake it up, pass it out see what happens

[00:59:00] kind of feeling

[00:59:02] and there is a PTR up now for Dragon Flight season 4

[00:59:08] as is my want to do we typically don't talk about a lot of stuff it's on the PTR this early because it's subject to change and who knows what's going on there

[00:59:19] but there is a post there's an official news post where they talk about the new and improved dungeon and sort of dungeon progression curve for heroic mythic and mythic plus

[00:59:33] I really like that

[00:59:35] talk about that for a little bit Jess what's the what's the big get with that so basically they've what they're trying to do is they're trying to make normal

[00:59:43] they're trying to make normal and heroic dungeons a little bit more relevant for longer

[00:59:48] and I kind of like that because you know it feels almost like you basically just the way it is right now you don't even do normal really

[00:59:57] you level up in normal and you just skip it forever there's no reason to like gear up in these dungeons and like even now like you kind of just skip

[01:00:06] you don't even really do mythic plus zero you just basically skip to like plus five or something with the gear that you've got from the previous season or whatever

[01:00:15] but like even at the start of the season like you don't really need to gear up you just go straight into mythic plus

[01:00:23] because all those are the lower dungeons just they were just way too easy I kind of feel like so I like the idea of it having a smoother progression

[01:00:35] sort of layer where each level is more meaningful and that that this they might screw it up it might it might not work as well as

[01:00:43] I'm not attending but I like I like the idea that it is going to be this sort of you know smoother progression and each level is going to be more meaningful

[01:00:53] and instead of just you know getting an upgrade upgrade that's like plus one level or something it's like a more meaningful bigger upgrade

[01:01:00] and it's more you know it just feels like maybe less of a grind or something I don't know I like the idea behind it

[01:01:07] with it will it pan out will actually be good I don't know but you know someone to do a lot of mythic plus so you know I'm one of them

[01:01:15] you know I don't I don't I don't push somebody got to be yeah I don't push too hard but I do like I do like to you know get the writing titles and

[01:01:25] amounts and stuff like that I don't I don't go much further than like plus 21 to maybe I'm not totally crazy but

[01:01:33] um but it's cool to see some of that stuff get rained in a little bit but I'll see what they do then

[01:01:39] yeah you gotta be careful you push too hard that's how you get him roads so at least you know if you yes

[01:01:45] to be get you know high enough to get some mounts and some other noble titles that you know that does always seem appealing to me

[01:01:55] even though I just don't run them I still scarred from my leveling experience back in the burning crusade era

[01:02:01] from dungeons I just I run them once and I'm like okay I'm good that's why I like the follower dungeon so much so

[01:02:07] I don't know well this will make um follow a dungeon to more relevant too because yeah it means the um

[01:02:13] the heroic the heroic track will reward a mythic plus zero gear now I think if I remember correctly

[01:02:19] so basically um yeah you're gonna get like um yeah yeah like you when you're running dungeons with followers you'll get

[01:02:29] a pics I think or at least uh higher on levels stuff so yeah because followers are all the way through to heroic right if I

[01:02:37] remember correctly right now or that just normal I don't know I you know what I'm not sure off hand

[01:02:45] I don't know I'm sure somebody old yelling at this wall or other listening to it saying what it is

[01:02:51] and whatever it is I'm sure you are right um yeah it's it's the dungeons the dungeons are always interesting

[01:02:58] you know ever since they introduced the idea of mythic plus it's revolutionized their relevance and so

[01:03:06] continuing to find ways to keep those dungeons relevant if for no other reason I think it's great

[01:03:11] the fact that they must spend a shit ton of time building these things and putting them together

[01:03:14] and coming up with all the bosses and abilities and yeah you don't want that to go to waste before

[01:03:20] it's time so finding a way to keep that relevant I think is wonderful and yes boosting anything I

[01:03:26] can do with my followers phenomenal in fact maybe one day maybe one day jazz I can go back to my garrison

[01:03:36] and put together some followers from my own dungeon group that would be so cool or even like

[01:03:43] because they're they're um they're bringing out the uh what did I call them now the war bands

[01:03:49] in well war with them yes so like basically your old maybe your olds can come with you in the

[01:03:54] follower dungeon that would be so sad I don't know oh my gosh the uh so yeah follower dungeons are

[01:04:00] normal mode only so but you have to imagine that as they improve the system they probably will

[01:04:06] expand it to a rowica maybe the mythic plus zero um I don't know why that wouldn't I mean

[01:04:12] if the technology improves and the IOI gets better and I don't know why you wouldn't

[01:04:17] wouldn't necessarily do that I think that's a really cool prestige yeah but that's what

[01:04:22] it's done with dungeon followers yeah but that's that's what mythic plus for you know no one cares

[01:04:27] about mythic plus zero prestige trust me that's as high as I've gone there's not a lot of prestige there

[01:04:35] there it just really is nobody gives it so yeah hopefully you're right there uh but yeah we've got

[01:04:41] we've got that coming uh in season four along with as they say I was to read this here powerful

[01:04:47] new rewards uh because you know gotta have a new currency here earn fresh rewards through PvE and

[01:04:53] PvP content good luck to you purchase them with a new currency antique bronze bullion or through the

[01:05:02] new gear upgrade track awakened so we have yet another new currency to manage and another gear

[01:05:09] upgrade track which I kind of poo poo those when we first started talking about them because all

[01:05:16] the crests and everything and I still do find it a little bit confusing but it seems to have been

[01:05:23] pretty popular the whole upgrade system yeah it seems confusing to start with but then

[01:05:34] once you get it you get it you know it is like oh it makes kind of make sense I um I'm actually

[01:05:41] quite happy by the rewards because they've brought back the slime kitty mount which I heard

[01:05:47] I missed that I missed that to shut alone so I'm really happy that brought that back um but I don't

[01:05:53] know if I don't know if my guild's gonna play season four then I might just take a break and wait

[01:05:57] for mmm because it's not I don't I don't know I'd rather have a new raid I'm kind of tired of

[01:06:07] the idea of doing the same raids over and over again just I just kind of I don't I don't know

[01:06:14] what it is I don't mind doing the dungeons over and over again but when it comes to raids I'm kind

[01:06:17] of like I'm ready to move on to the next bit of story stuff I don't know but I do like that they've

[01:06:26] brought this the dungeon pool will be all of the dragon flight dungeons for this one yep I like

[01:06:31] that because honestly I've missed I haven't really done some of them that much because they've never

[01:06:39] been in the pool so um it's kind of cool to you know do some of those that weren't in the pools that

[01:06:45] much um let's try and push those but um I would have preferred a new dungeon personally but

[01:06:52] can't have it all and I suppose most of the teams working on the war within now which I suppose is

[01:06:58] the more important you know effort right now I know you for the song as you're missing dungeon

[01:07:06] yeah I don't like that I don't like that I always I always compare like the final patch of an

[01:07:12] expansion I always compare it to the song well I always compare it to Sunwell man Sunwell like

[01:07:19] fucking Hall of Fame pantheon level like you can't compete with Sunwell yeah I know I know I

[01:07:25] know it was like literally almost 20 years ago but it was like we got a new island we got a cool

[01:07:33] new dungeon that finished so great we got a brutally difficult raid the raid of Sobrut or one of

[01:07:41] the bosses was called Brutulus um it was it was an amazing patch and nowadays it's kind of like

[01:07:49] again these faded seasons a kind of they're getting formulaic and you know already yeah already

[01:07:57] you've done it once and now you're doing it again and it's not like you'll you'll get to the end

[01:08:02] of the war within and they're like okay no here's the faded season again and it's like oh I don't

[01:08:07] I don't want the fade season I'm just gonna unsubscribe and play some other games because there's

[01:08:12] a lot of competition out there I'm my backlog for Xbox games is extreme it is extreme and if a game

[01:08:20] if a service game gives me a reason to not play it for any reason I will not play it and just

[01:08:25] take my backlog for a bit and these faded seasons are kind of slipping into that category for me but

[01:08:31] I don't know you think it's better for them I mean given the time constraints would it be better

[01:08:36] just to have a patch just go on for months and months and months with nothing or does it seem

[01:08:41] like we it's one or the other it seems like the choice they've given us I think what this is

[01:08:47] probably what I would do right I don't know some people probably won't like this but what I would

[01:08:54] do is I would probably make mythic raids a little bit easier and make it so like you can outgear

[01:09:03] them a bit because right now you can't really outgear a mythic raid unless you're like super pro

[01:09:11] so like for for my guild for example at our skill level or you know the level that we're

[01:09:16] million to commit to you know min maxing and stuff we have like no opportunity to go beyond heroic

[01:09:26] which you know you could argue is fine and I completely understand that sentiment but at the same

[01:09:31] time it means that the vast majority of the playbass ends up with no more progression I think

[01:09:37] you know we can some of our some of our guild can can get mythic gear from doing mythic plus 20

[01:09:44] or higher or whatever it is but a lot of our guild these can't and we don't want to be one of

[01:09:50] these guilds where like we treat like a job and we have job applications and if someone isn't

[01:09:54] you know full full blown min maxing like we bench them we don't do any of that stuff so

[01:09:59] I hope I hated those days I remember those days well I hated those days yeah those days start and

[01:10:05] you know and I don't begrudge people that do want to play at that level and I definitely think

[01:10:09] that level of play should exist but I think like when if like you raid tier progression pretty much

[01:10:16] ends up heroic that kind of like makes the tier almost end for a lot of people I think but there's

[01:10:22] literally not there's literally no reason for us to continue playing once we've killed the

[01:10:29] Farak heroic because the gear we get from mythic plus 20 is better you know yeah so it kind

[01:10:35] it takes the fun out of it a little bit so I would like I would keep the seasons going on a bit longer

[01:10:43] I thought like these two seasons it felt like the season ended quite abruptly I felt Farak was

[01:10:50] we cleared heroic so quickly I think we killed Farak on the second pull which is

[01:10:55] which is weird I think for a heroic raid yeah second or third pull something like that

[01:11:03] so we we breeze through this tier really quickly but still mythic is such a jump such a huge jump

[01:11:09] from heroic and we just don't have the guild to do that so yeah I would drag the seasons on a

[01:11:17] little bit longer maybe even consider making heroic maybe a little bit harder maybe but then also

[01:11:25] making mythic bit easier so you can ease into the curve a bit more and it was weird that we killed

[01:11:31] Farak in two pulls I think maybe that's pretty good I know our guild well the theme that I was a

[01:11:38] part of that I don't know the word really rating anymore but um rogue was always a pretty good

[01:11:45] challenge for us and I do think that we were a little bit on the lower end of this guild you know

[01:11:52] as a group and I fully admit that I'm part of that like I'm not a world beater by any means

[01:11:59] so we we always found heroic to be a pretty good challenge but I watched as the other groups around

[01:12:03] it's just slaughtered everything in a mirrored skill and I was like wow we're really like even we

[01:12:11] are we clear it through normal pretty quickly and we were making some progress on heroic before the team

[01:12:16] essentially was done um I don't know it's it's the pendulum swing back and forth it's like oh this

[01:12:23] rates too hard oh now this rates too easy oh yeah I get it there were so many people complaining

[01:12:29] about the race to world first when it was you know oh we're going on too long this last boss taking

[01:12:34] too long and then when they didn't take as long oh now it's too easy and this is bad yeah it's

[01:12:39] it's a really hard balance to strike because there are there are players of all different skill levels

[01:12:44] and stuff I think like the I think the raid probably could have done with more bosses maybe like at least

[01:12:52] to give people more road bumps and I like time to get through them or something I like that um

[01:12:58] but I the progression just run out really quickly this season I don't know and I suppose um

[01:13:04] and I'm not a hardcore player but only means like well I don't consider myself to be one

[01:13:09] like I don't I'm not someone who you know I work a full-time job but raid once we raid once a week

[01:13:15] for two hours and we clear the mids or so like really quickly we're not like yeah but like

[01:13:20] it's not it's not bragging it's like we're not super hardcore and we have we have a tears where

[01:13:24] we did struggle um but for what I don't I really did feel like this this tear was easy I don't know

[01:13:32] why maybe we just had lots of gear coming in from last season or something but I don't know more

[01:13:38] I think that's the conundrum where I was always hard it's like everyone constantly wants more content

[01:13:45] as soon as possible I think my kibara said it back when he was prezz and now he's gone rip yeah

[01:13:53] and it takes time it takes time to get that stuff in people's hands and you know

[01:13:57] consume it at a pretty good rate and you know for folks like yourself or others who've cleared it

[01:14:03] you know getting the head of the curve achievement is you have done it timely because once season

[01:14:08] four hits that goes away that head of the curve achieved goes away and we're looking probably not

[01:14:16] too much longer until we see the rest of this unfold season four start I mean I mean within a month

[01:14:24] you think yep I think so probably go so so on this we had the official post come out and they've

[01:14:32] talked about all the stuff we just talked about with the dungeons new currency and the dungeon pool

[01:14:42] you know if you complete the raids now on different difficulties what the rewards are for those

[01:14:49] we need to hear from Holly Longdale who as you mentioned before kind of on the heels of

[01:14:59] thunderstorm she put up a post about more world of warcraft experiences to come I do wonder if

[01:15:06] this was planned or if in response to us TV ears going with the fuck it says greeting citizens

[01:15:13] of Azeroth it's been great seeing so many players taking the plunge into plunder storm and we've

[01:15:19] loved seeing all of the stories and feedback as this experimental event evolves people be exciting

[01:15:25] to see some of you some of the community content creators going head to head as duos during the

[01:15:29] plunder storm greater royale on March 30th this was posted back on March 28th so that's why it was

[01:15:34] upcoming this isn't the end of the things we want to try in world of warcraft however and we have more

[01:15:40] in store we can't wait to show you dragon flight season four is en route as testing begins on the

[01:15:45] ptr we'll have more news to share soon the tm trademark those joke about soon what that means

[01:15:51] around here on the next experiment we have up our sleeves on the next experiment we have up our

[01:15:58] sleeves we hope those of you who are looking for pve focus content will enjoy what we're planning

[01:16:03] all while we continue to press forward on development of our next expansion world of warcraft

[01:16:09] war within yet we just share with you all the many things the team has been hard at work on

[01:16:13] gratitude and excitement for what we'll do together next hallelong down which

[01:16:19] I will add alpha's coming and I think some of us may have seen a sign up so it's coming folks the

[01:16:31] alpha is coming very soon so when I hear this isn't the end of the things we want to try and world of

[01:16:39] warcraft and we have more in store we can't wait to show you and then we're talking about pve

[01:16:46] does this indicate that we there's another secret thing coming up between now and like more within

[01:16:52] pre patch is that how every day I would think so I think like season four needs

[01:17:00] I think they're cognizant of the fact that they don't want things to feel formulaic and

[01:17:05] faded faded at the end of the season feels formulaic but maybe they can throw something in there

[01:17:11] to mix it up a bit some extra kind of feature something you know but maybe let's just wish for

[01:17:18] thinking on my part I suppose won't be long till we find out you know something they've done

[01:17:25] in previous expansions is drop expansion features into retail early I'm thinking about things like

[01:17:38] when they added I remember when they added the new pvp system they dropped that in there I think

[01:17:48] and you know new level caps and new features I can't I can't remember off the top of my head but like

[01:17:54] some of the new you know cat class abilities and stuff like that could they like launch

[01:18:00] hero talents with season four like just the first tier of it maybe or something

[01:18:06] just to put some people can play around with it because like those first tier talents are pretty

[01:18:12] powerful by themselves and they completely change your class yeah and that'll be a pretty good way

[01:18:18] to set the scene for war within you know let me set like don't give me the full tree but just

[01:18:26] give me like the the first talent maybe let me summon all those extra demons from the demonology

[01:18:33] tree or I think the I mean the paladins were upset about this but I thought this sounded really

[01:18:39] cool like the lightsmithing where you can summon weapons that people can pick up at equip you know

[01:18:45] like made of made of the light and stuff like that and also death nights get mounted combat and shit

[01:18:52] like that you know that is so fucking cool like it is super cool yes drop that drop the first

[01:18:59] talent for every hero tree into into season four let the chaos begin I think that that could be

[01:19:06] an interesting way to to add a bit of spice to next season also tease people for the next expansion

[01:19:13] yeah it's gonna be interesting to see now that we've had plunderstorm you know we I think as a

[01:19:19] player base have a very bad habit of once we've seen a thing we expect the next thing to always

[01:19:24] be like that last thing so like when we looked at patch cycles well it was this last time so we

[01:19:31] should expect that a patch comes out here and when like that didn't happen people lost the shit

[01:19:36] or we expect a x feature to be just like this and now it's different and oh and you know of course

[01:19:43] there's people that are like oh it's the same shit and I don't like it but we we get married to our

[01:19:48] expectations as a player base and now I think with a separate game like thunderstorm now it's gonna

[01:19:54] be okay are we gonna get our I don't know first person shooter in world of warcraft as like a separate

[01:20:03] client where everyone's a hunter and I don't know you got to go through and shoot murlocs or

[01:20:09] something like you know is that the kind of thing that we're gonna expect now every time is that

[01:20:15] there's going to be some third person thing where now it's going to be I don't know castle wash

[01:20:21] simulator and you gotta stand outside your capital city and like power wash the thing and that's

[01:20:25] like hey I want to buy castle watch simulator that's on say see there it is that I think it's

[01:20:31] gonna be kind of our expectation now so I don't know like I hope I hope they keep experimenting

[01:20:38] because I do think it's fun I'm glad that they're doing that sort of thing because it is hard to

[01:20:44] manage the existing game and then add a bunch of wild shit because there's just so much architecture

[01:20:48] in many ways that it's built on um yeah maybe castle wash simulator maybe that'll be the PVE

[01:20:55] content you've all been waiting for I love it I want castle wash simulator let's let's go make

[01:21:01] it and then we'll sell it back home see if we can get like a lifetime subscriptions for it oh my god

[01:21:07] they could totally do castle wash simulator and I engine there you go hey man there you go man

[01:21:14] you've just given them a great idea and you know what I'm just making sure that when we hit

[01:21:18] that low in the subscriber curve that I'm doing my part to keep that revenue rolling in because

[01:21:23] god god forbid something happens this game and I gotta get a real hobby all right so season four

[01:21:30] you don't know quite when it's gonna hit we assume it's gonna be sometime soon this that it was

[01:21:35] part of the two six patch stuff so it should be you know within the next episode or two of this show

[01:21:40] and of course as we get closer and things pop up we'll talk about it in the meantime right now very

[01:21:45] much live is noble garden mentioned noble garden earlier only runs one week April 1st to April 8th

[01:21:51] it's all over the place you have to check your check your map and or your favorite news site

[01:21:58] and they'll have more information about this you're gathering the noble garden chocolates remember

[01:22:04] that's your currency new this year you got some delicious whether it be european or american they are

[01:22:11] delicious and either fall bell dragon bell dragons decked out that's what's new this year apparently

[01:22:18] and we got some activities defending against ducks and doing some other stuff and there is a flying

[01:22:24] carpet mount that you can get there's some other transmog some pets some ducks if you really

[01:22:30] into ducks this is your jam if you're into ducks noble garden is your jam along with a hard stone

[01:22:36] that's kind of cool makes you the center of all forced animals and a few other things going on

[01:22:42] but that is going on right now just do you participate in noble garden activities

[01:22:47] i don't i don't it's not it's too happy for me i'm i don't put on your bunny ears no look for eggs

[01:22:55] no no no no no i'm for sake and slash goblins well i suppose goblins would be all like all over this

[01:23:03] like selling stuff i guess but yeah it's too bright and colorful for me i'm like holding eggs

[01:23:08] hello zen's mom my my speed i think oh

[01:23:15] i'll put on that one too yeah yeah so while we may not be doing noble garden feel free to jump in

[01:23:22] yourself and enjoy all of the festivities and you've got until april 8th to do so the very last

[01:23:30] item i had that i just wanted to bring to y'all's attention is recently out on the blizzard gear

[01:23:37] store they started selling these keycaps which are there's a hoard and an alliance keycap it's

[01:23:45] it go you like you replace a key on your keyboard and their treasure chests one horde theme

[01:23:51] one alliance theme and i bring this up because i always like to promote local businesses in northern

[01:23:57] california this is based in northern california in a town here uh a college town uh davis

[01:24:04] and it's run through the company clackies clackies and i say all of this to say i want to support

[01:24:11] a local business uh around uh this part of the state but i'm fully aware of the fact that $60

[01:24:17] for one of these things is it's a tall word i'll admit when when i first showed this to jazz

[01:24:24] off air and your reaction was 57 euros yeah i uh you know artisanal keycaps

[01:24:36] they've it's a very lucrative business i see these keycaps on etsy a lot and actually own some

[01:24:42] iona iona pokemon escape key and i've actually got a horde a horde key as well my

[01:24:48] okay i'm a keyboard but it's it's it's not the best quality in the world and i think it still

[01:24:53] cost me like 20 euros and these are like hand painted look like treasure chests they look really

[01:24:59] good so you know peeps got to get paid and then brisids got to get it's uh got i suppose

[01:25:07] that i said california i mean you got to pay your labor and you got a baby cost yeah will you be going

[01:25:12] what i don't support supporting local business i want to man i'm having a hard time finding

[01:25:20] that 60 bucks for that i don't know i had maybe maybe we can work out a deal do it give away

[01:25:26] there's something i was actually gonna think that i might appreciate to give it one for a

[01:25:29] for a disco or something yeah i don't have to send him an email

[01:25:34] it's a bit like no it's not i mean 60 i said deals should be a hundred or this fine artisanal

[01:25:40] work so anyway i think the super cool cost admit it it might be prohibitive uh but if you're

[01:25:48] into such a thing they do look pretty rad uh it's on the blizzard store clackies is the company

[01:25:54] and they also have some other ones like some transformers keycaps that look pretty sweet

[01:25:58] and some gaming mats and real like old school stuff that uh did legitimately look pretty sweet so

[01:26:04] give them a look check them out and they're on the gear store now if you are so inclined

[01:26:11] all right i think we've done enough damage for one episode those who don't already know

[01:26:17] work and the good people find you on the internet jaz you can find me on twitter slash x at jaz

[01:26:24] cordon jaz at sewardian and also on witticentral.com forward slash gaming and also i've got an

[01:26:30] xbox podcast on youtube called xb2 podcast i've also started streaming on my own youtube channel

[01:26:39] which is just jaz.c i think i need to come up with an actual name for that i think probably uh

[01:26:46] so yeah if you search for jaz.c you're probably far mainstream i streamed dragons dogmo recently

[01:26:51] that was fun um but yeah all over the internet the old jaz there is one and one step closer to

[01:26:59] getting invited to the next battle royale oh by the way hopefully yes um i found out recently that

[01:27:07] jaz is Polish for hedgehog there you go

[01:27:10] learn something new every day uh listen into unshackled fury we'll keep it that way

[01:27:17] so from from the hedgehog uh himself uh to us uh thank you all of you we're listening

[01:27:26] to this show and uh make sure to look jazz up in those places and remember you can always

[01:27:30] follow me as well and this show on twitter at berserker rage and uncheckled underscore fury

[01:27:36] on blue sky at berserker and uncheckled fury as well as on twitch at unshackled fury in real berserker

[01:27:41] which we haven't used but god damn what we need to use now your streaming may be out of do something

[01:27:45] soon now put that in the back of my brain you can also join our discord links for which are in

[01:27:49] the profile the show on twitter and on our bonus role page feel free to contact the show with your

[01:27:54] questions comments or otherwise through any of those resources or uncheckledferia.com and you

[01:27:59] can find this show wherever you get your podcasts so once again thank you for listening

[01:28:05] remember to keep your swords wet in your banners high and we'll see you next time farewell